Building permits?

comarro · Thu, Sep-21-2006, 01:21:26 AM

I am going to enclose my patio into a living space and was wanting to know if a building permit is needed. The patio already has a roof and cemet floor and is in old neigborhood w/o the rules. I have no clue when it come to this:nixweiss:

**ArtM3** · Thu, Sep-21-2006, 01:52:35 AM

it varies greatly by locale, since the IBC was adopted it's got worse (better for me

) in that you may need an engineer to prepare a package to submit and have approved...

call you building dept. or code enforcement

04M3Vert · Thu, Sep-21-2006, 01:57:22 AM

Building permit requirements vary from state to state and town to town. Depending on what your cities individual requirements are, will depend on what you need.

Some of the more strict ones will require that you submit drawings with details for review and approval with the permit application.

In general the building permit process was instituted as a way to protect the public from contractors doing sub-standard work and leaving the home owner with latent defects. If you are doing the improvements yourself, you might not have to go through formal inspections by the building inspectors. This varies from place to place. Electrical, plumbing, HVAC and structural upgrades will be the items most reviewed for code compliance.

Also, I'm not sure of the age of your house, but if it's not up to current electrical codes, some cities allow a house to remain as is, unless an improvement is performed. At which time the homeowner is obligated to bring the entire house into current code compliance and not just the renovated or new work. This can get extremely costly if you have to rip out all of your current wiring and upgrade the panels, etc.

Now, unless you're making too much noise or annoy one of your neighbors, there's a very high chance no one will ever know if you don't get a permit. Usually building inspectors are very busy and really don't have time to patrol neighborhoods looking for un-approved home improvements. Most building permit violations are the result of a pissed off neighbor, who notices you don't have the permit posted and calls the building department to report you.

Even if they were to come around, sometimes it's easier to ask for forgiveness than it is to ask for permission.

ART - isn't PA one of the few places that allows a home owner to perform renovation work without a sealed drawing as long as the home owner performs the work and not an independent contractor? BTW where in SW PA are you?

comarro · Thu, Sep-21-2006, 01:59:59 AM

That is what I have been hearing and it will cost like 5% to have the blueprints added. What is worse would happen if it was just enclosed in a weekend

Blutarsky · Thu, Sep-21-2006, 02:06:00 AM

keep in mind that building w/out permits could hurt the saleability of the home. also, if you do it yourself, you don't have anyone to sue if the addition catches fire and burns the whole house down

**ArtM3** · Thu, Sep-21-2006, 02:09:36 AM

near Uniontown

as far as exemptions, they are trying to get the law ammended, but as it stands you are supposed to apply for a permit...but it's seldom enforced...but we have had more than a few 'walk ins' who were stopped while building garages and additions and caught by an inspector...

the home owner can do it himself, but since it is reviewed by an outside contracted agency, they make it hard, especially if there are any electrical or structural mods...

Quote:

Originally Posted by 04M3Vert

ART - isn't PA one of the few places that allows a home owner to perform renovation work without a sealed drawing as long as the home owner performs the work and not an independent contractor? BTW where in SW PA are you?

**ArtM3** · Thu, Sep-21-2006, 02:14:49 AM

I've not hear of anyone not being 'grandfathered' in either...although at times to expend a place, other work needs done to bring the foundation (be it structual, electrical, etc.) into compliance...

but if for example you're adding a couple of circuits to a non-current code compliant box, they don't make you upgrade the box...

they are much more stringent for commercial/industrial/etc.

comarro · Thu, Sep-21-2006, 02:22:16 AM

I am undecided, so that is why I would like to have it just enclosed studs (floating wall), windows and outside siding to match, by a experienced worker. Then have electrical, insulation, and whatever it is going to be done by a pro. Aslo, what happens when I go to sell do I need to have the square footage re-done? The house is in a old 50s neigborhood.
Thanks for the info bty!!!

Ovecka · Thu, Sep-21-2006, 05:05:20 AM

GET THE PERMITS! If you build anything it is best to make sure you have the permits no matter how minor. Because if by some odd chance the city/township finds out about they will come out and MAKE YOU TEAR IT DOWN. A deck or whatever esle. I have heard of this in PA as well.

johnewhite · Thu, Sep-21-2006, 05:11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by comarro

I am going to enclose my patio into a living space and was wanting to know if a building permit is needed. The patio already has a roof and cemet floor and is in old neigborhood w/o the rules. I have no clue when it come to this:nixweiss:

Yes...........

Thu, Sep-21-2006, 01:21:26 AM	#1
comarro Registered User Join Date: Aug 2004 Age: 33 Posts: 69 Reputation: 0 Location: Denver/Colorado	Building permits? I am going to enclose my patio into a living space and was wanting to know if a building permit is needed. The patio already has a roof and cemet floor and is in old neigborhood w/o the rules. I have no clue when it come to this:nixweiss:

Thu, Sep-21-2006, 01:57:22 AM	#3
04M3Vert Registered User Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 334 Reputation: 0 Location: Pittsburgh	Building permit requirements vary from state to state and town to town. Depending on what your cities individual requirements are, will depend on what you need. Some of the more strict ones will require that you submit drawings with details for review and approval with the permit application. In general the building permit process was instituted as a way to protect the public from contractors doing sub-standard work and leaving the home owner with latent defects. If you are doing the improvements yourself, you might not have to go through formal inspections by the building inspectors. This varies from place to place. Electrical, plumbing, HVAC and structural upgrades will be the items most reviewed for code compliance. Also, I'm not sure of the age of your house, but if it's not up to current electrical codes, some cities allow a house to remain as is, unless an improvement is performed. At which time the homeowner is obligated to bring the entire house into current code compliance and not just the renovated or new work. This can get extremely costly if you have to rip out all of your current wiring and upgrade the panels, etc. Now, unless you're making too much noise or annoy one of your neighbors, there's a very high chance no one will ever know if you don't get a permit. Usually building inspectors are very busy and really don't have time to patrol neighborhoods looking for un-approved home improvements. Most building permit violations are the result of a pissed off neighbor, who notices you don't have the permit posted and calls the building department to report you. Even if they were to come around, sometimes it's easier to ask for forgiveness than it is to ask for permission. ART - isn't PA one of the few places that allows a home owner to perform renovation work without a sealed drawing as long as the home owner performs the work and not an independent contractor? BTW where in SW PA are you? Last edited by 04M3Vert; Thu, Sep-21-2006 at 02:00:29 AM.

Thu, Sep-21-2006, 02:06:00 AM	#5
Blutarsky Vintage Pimp Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 15,061 Reputation: 0 Location: Oregon	keep in mind that building w/out permits could hurt the saleability of the home. also, if you do it yourself, you don't have anyone to sue if the addition catches fire and burns the whole house down __________________ chaos is hangin around

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Thu, Sep-21-2006, 01:52:35 AM	#2
ArtM3 Banned Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 33,063 Reputation: 0	it varies greatly by locale, since the IBC was adopted it's got worse (better for me ) in that you may need an engineer to prepare a package to submit and have approved... call you building dept. or code enforcement

Thu, Sep-21-2006, 01:59:59 AM	#4
comarro Registered User Join Date: Aug 2004 Age: 33 Posts: 69 Reputation: 0 Location: Denver/Colorado	That is what I have been hearing and it will cost like 5% to have the blueprints added. What is worse would happen if it was just enclosed in a weekend

Thu, Sep-21-2006, 02:14:49 AM	#7
ArtM3 Banned Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 33,063 Reputation: 0	I've not hear of anyone not being 'grandfathered' in either...although at times to expend a place, other work needs done to bring the foundation (be it structual, electrical, etc.) into compliance... but if for example you're adding a couple of circuits to a non-current code compliant box, they don't make you upgrade the box... they are much more stringent for commercial/industrial/etc.

Thu, Sep-21-2006, 02:22:16 AM	#8
comarro Registered User Join Date: Aug 2004 Age: 33 Posts: 69 Reputation: 0 Location: Denver/Colorado	I am undecided, so that is why I would like to have it just enclosed studs (floating wall), windows and outside siding to match, by a experienced worker. Then have electrical, insulation, and whatever it is going to be done by a pro. Aslo, what happens when I go to sell do I need to have the square footage re-done? The house is in a old 50s neigborhood. Thanks for the info bty!!!

Thu, Sep-21-2006, 05:05:20 AM	#9
Ovecka Registered User Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 2,286 Reputation: 0	GET THE PERMITS! If you build anything it is best to make sure you have the permits no matter how minor. Because if by some odd chance the city/township finds out about they will come out and MAKE YOU TEAR IT DOWN. A deck or whatever esle. I have heard of this in PA as well.